‘Devil Dog’ No Longer Acceptable?
June 24th, 2008 . by CaryIf you are a Marine, please take the time to read and comment. If you are not a Marine, then it’s up to you whether you read this or not. The issue was brought to my attention by Akinoluna. She blogged about the trend of the term “Devil Dog” to be looked on as a curse more than a point of pride.
Personally, I find this trend disturbing. I am very proud of the nickname “Devil Dog” and find it odd that the younger Marines of today would be bothered by it. However, I will take to task those of higher rank that use it only when getting ready to issue a correction or reprimand – of course it would become associated with bad behavior. The idea behind using it, as stated in the article:
“I think the backlash against ‘Devil Dog’ does begin with the leadership. [Noncommissioned officers] (myself included) use the following phrase, ‘HEY, DEVIL DOG!’ to initiate a ‘correction’ when we don’t know exactly who the Marine may be. Thusly, hearing the phrase Devil Dog creates a negative Pavlovian response in Marines. As they come up in the Corps, the response stays,” one Marine wrote.
(emphasis mine) (yes, I know the article appeared back in April. sue me.)
Now, when I was serving, if you didn’t know who the Marine was, you would use the term “Marine” to get their attention. “Devil Dog” was reserved for when you knew who were motivating – and it was used as motivation: “Come on, you Devil Dogs! Let’s take that hill!”
Corrections or reprimands would start out with you, the corrector or reprimandor, spotting a goldbricker slouching across the parade deck (for example) and hollering out, “Hey, MARINE!” This would get their attention and allow you to quickly determine the rank of the offender.
You would then issue the correction based on their rank: if the Marine in question was of lower rank, then “boot” or “maggot” was used to get your point across: “Hey, maggot – quit dragging your heels whilst strolling across my parade deck – step to smartly, and make it look like you know where you’re going!”
If the Marine was of the same rank, then a more comradely term would be used: “You know, corporal, by dragging your heels while walking across the parade deck some boot might think that was the way to do it. Let’s try stepping a little more lively to impress the newbies.”
If the Marine was of higher rank, then a whole new attitude would have to surround the conversation: “Good morning, Second Lieutenant Wetbehindtheears, here on the hallowed grounds of the Third Battalion, we have a tradition of either circumventing the parade deck or stepping off in a smart manner in order to impart the respect we have for those who have passed before.”
Using “Devil Dog” as a jumping-off point for corrections is setting a bad example – and chewing up the traditions of the Corps. Shame on the Marine who helps tear this fabric. Let’s show some respect for those who HAVE passed before!
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There is MUCH to be said for tradition, and TRADITION should be honored.
BZ
Amen to that, Brother BZ.
Being a Marine sister, I have to agree with you in that tradition should most definitely be honored. I’ll leave the rest of the debate to the jarheads out there.
Your opinion is not only valued here, Sues, but expected. Especially because of who you are related to.
There is no other branch of the Military who honours tradition more than the United States Marine Corps.
Surely the younger Marines know how the name “”Devil Dog”” was begun as a tribute by an enemy and not as a form of denigration. It is most troubling that any Marine would do any dishonour to that tribute to those Marines of World War I. Here’s hoping the Corps deals with this issue in an timely manner so that Marines may return to doing what they do best…defending America.
Please pardon the comments of a civilian, but this touches us all.
I was pretty disgusted when I saw this in the Marine Times. It pissed me the heck off. I too blame the NCO leadership for this. I also blame the NCO leadership for whining about not having enough responsibility. They are where the rubber meets the road.
The term Devil Dog was not created by us, it was bestowed as a badge of honor by our own enemies for our ferociousness. I’m not going to let some PFC tell me that I cannot use that title because he/she may or may not find it demeaning. Don’t like it? Too damned bad…tell me about it at PT tomorrow.
Our traditions are sacred, and worth upholding. I don’t care what some reporter says. Send him to me, and I’ll counsel him in a suitable manner. (unwritten high-five to Cary).
Okay Just John, how would you feel if I said you were gay? Would you assume I thought you were a “happy” person or a “homosexual” person? If the usage of a word changes, you can’t force people to like it based on the word’s history. PFCs aren’t saying you can’t use it, they are simply saying that it’s no longer always a positive thing to called “devil dog”.
Oh, another thing I remembered…in some places, only senior Marines can call junior Marines “devil dog”. If a lance corporal called his gunny “devil dog” he’d better run for cover afterwards…
Um, sorry, one more thing! hehe. Did you know there’s a verb form too? Saying someone got “devil dogged” i.e, got called devil dog in an insulting way. 🙂
There is no such phrase as “”devil dogged”” in the history of the United States Marine Corps. Any such bastardization of the badge of honour of Devil Dog is purely a modern connotation on the part of younger Marines who apparently need to return to history class.
My apologies to you, Cary, and all Marines, both Active-Duty and Veteran, who are visitors to this site, if you feel that I have overstepped my bounds by replying.
Yut yut, OooRah, Semper Fi Devil Dog.. 🙂
And let’s be totally honest, Marinews have been called a lot worse things, usually by enemies of the USA, just before the Marines killed em…
Now I’m done, Semper Fi!!
Loon – your opinion does matter here. As a civilian, you have a different perspective, but it is one that I respect. I agree that the tradition shouldn’t be messed with. But, since I am not active duty, I can’t do anything about it from here.
Just John – we are of the same mind on this. I can’t add anything to what you said.
Akinoluna, I think the epithet of “gay” cannot be compared to “Devil Dog” – one is self-proclaimed, and the other is a nickname bestowed.
I understand what you are saying about the directionality of the nickname; I am saying that the tradition was that even the lowest, most boot E-1 could refer to the Commandant as “Devil Dog” and, at the time I was serving, there would be big grins all around, because of the claim to fame that came with the name.
Whether someone wants to try to verb the phrase, it can’t be an insult, in my opinion, because of the manner it was born. It was meant as a phrase describing the ferocious fighting ability of the Marines, and the Germans were in awe of what they had just witnessed.
The New Corps seems to lack a certain… something… flavor? attitude? awareness?
Again, Loon – reply at will. I cannot imagine a time when I would tell you to not reply or comment on here.
TexasFred – we’ve been called a lot worse, by a lot better, for less insult or injury.
The Navy springs to mind rather readily…
Yutyut, OohRah, Semper Fi, Devil Dog!!!
It has been my experience that some times the Marine Corps Times people look for those few “disgruntaled employees” and find “problems” that don’t exist.
Devil Dog is a compliment to me, as is Jarhead, Leatherneck, Grunt, Dirt People etc. But I have known those who objected. I think it’s a matter of insecurity that some object. In my experience a more common team used by a Gunny in correcting a young Marine who has screwed up would begin … Hey Sh*thead … or other pleasantries.
But you know what … the Corps is no “Touchy Feely” kinda club. It is a direct, primal and forceful lean mean killing machine.
There you have it, jim b – the liberals have infested (infected?) the Marine Corps Times, too.
I remember well a counseling session or three that would begin much as you have described. And, yes, the other terms you have listed are also worn with pride by the majority of Marines I know.
Thanks for stopping by!
Well, not wanting to offend any of my marine brothers, I will now refer to you all as ‘SATANIC PUPPIES’. No confusion there…
That’s OK, Gawfer, you can still call us Devil Dogs.
In fact, you better stick with “Devil Dogs” since it’s only three syllables; “satanic puppies” has five and I wouldn’t want you to hurt yourself trying to use that many sounds in a row.
Naw, it’s only the Marines that max out with two syllable words; eg. Yut Yut, OO-Rah, Sem-per fi, dev-il dawgs, etc.
Funny, funny man.
Thank you so much for stopping by.
Would it be okay, Cary, to point out that the reason that Marines don’t have time for words with more than 2 syllables is that they’re too busy defending America?
It’s not okay? Then I won’t say anything.
(( grinning ))
Loon, is there a reason why you left out the four other branches of the armed forces that also defending America?
Granted, the Marines are the prettiest, but…
Prettiest?
No, that would be the thailors in their thpiffy crackerjackth…
Again, Loon, you have permission to speak freely here. Any thing, any topic, any time. And, if it happens to upset a squid or two, that’s just a bonus.